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10 February 2014 @ 09:57 pm
On the way to the US citizenship  
Today I've passed my US citizenship interview.
Next step is the Oath of Allegiance (in about 7 weeks).
 
 
 
журнал закрытjuan_gandhi on February 11th, 2014 04:27 am (UTC)
AOath.

Congratulations!

And a reminder, you don't have to say the pledge!
Dennis Gorelikdennisgorelik on February 11th, 2014 02:25 pm (UTC)
1) Thanks, I still cannot nail down these a/the articles.

2) How do you know that you don't have to say the pledge?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oath_of_allegiance
"Oaths of allegiance are commonly required of newly naturalised citizens"
журнал закрытjuan_gandhi on February 11th, 2014 06:01 pm (UTC)
I hope you know the difference between the oath, which is about the country, and the pledge, which is about the flag and god above.
Dennis Gorelik: 2009dennisgorelik on February 11th, 2014 06:29 pm (UTC)
I did NOT know that!

-------
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pledge_of_Allegiance
Supreme Court has ruled on several occasions that students cannot be compelled to recite the Pledge, nor can they be punished for not doing so.

.....
concluding that "compulsory unification of opinion" violates the First Amendment.
.....
Many objections have been raised since the addition of the phrase "under God" to the Pledge in 1954. Critics contend that a government requiring or promoting this phrase violates protections against the establishment of religion guaranteed in the Establishment Clause of the First Amendment.
-------

Still, I don't see any reference of the Pledge being optional for naturalized citizens.
Do you have any references to that?


Edited at 2014-02-11 06:29 pm (UTC)
журнал закрытjuan_gandhi on February 11th, 2014 09:37 pm (UTC)
I don't remember, but well, I never said the pledge. I'm an atheist, and it's a matter of principle.

Look here: http://www.uscis.gov/sites/default/files/files/article/M-476.pdf

It never even mentioned the pledge, which is about allegiance to the flag, and which some religions will object against, too.

The Oath of Allegiance
I hereby declare, on oath,

that I absolutely and entirely renounce and abjure all
allegiance and fidelity to any foreign prince,
potentate, state, or sovereignty, of whom or which I
have heretofore been a subject or citizen;
that I will support and defend the Constitution and
laws of the United States of America against all
enemies, foreign and domestic;

that I will bear true faith and allegiance to the same;

that I will bear arms on behalf of the United States
when required by the law;
that I will perform noncombatant service in the Armed
Forces of the United States when required by the
law;
that I will perform work of national importance under
civilian direction when required by the law; and
that I take this obligation freely without any
mental reservation or purpose of evasion; so help
me God.


Sounds pretty good to me.
Dennis Gorelik: 2009dennisgorelik on February 11th, 2014 10:16 pm (UTC)
If you are unable or unwilling to take the oath with the words “on oath” and “so help me God” included, you must notify USCIS that you wish to take a modified Oath of Allegiance.
Applicants are not required to provide any evidence or testimony to support a request for this type 
of modification.
Have you tried to exclude “so help me God” from your Oath?

Edited at 2014-02-11 10:19 pm (UTC)
журнал закрытjuan_gandhi on February 11th, 2014 11:13 pm (UTC)
No; actually I'm totally fine with "help me God"; I can even say "inshallah"; it's totally cool. It's not recognition, in my view. To me it translates like "oh fuck it!'.
Dennis Gorelikdennisgorelik on February 11th, 2014 11:16 pm (UTC)
Were you thinking that when you were saying your oath?
:-)

Anyway, do they ask to say a pledge too, or the pledge is only for children in school?
журнал закрытjuan_gandhi on February 11th, 2014 11:52 pm (UTC)
I spent some time thinking about it way before.

And yes, after all this, and after congratulations etc, everybody stands up and they all say the pledge.

In my case there were two that did not, me, and a Chinese guy.
Dennis Gorelikdennisgorelik on February 12th, 2014 01:58 am (UTC)
Are you saying that the pledge was after the oath, not before?

Did you stand up for the pledge?

What year was that?
журнал закрытjuan_gandhi on February 12th, 2014 02:31 am (UTC)
It's in the end of the event.
And yes, I did stand up; the idea being, I respect other people that are standing. Shit, had to calculate every step. It was about 2008 or something like that.
Dennis Gorelikdennisgorelik on February 12th, 2014 03:06 am (UTC)
> Shit, had to calculate every step.

Was it hard/unpleasant to calculate every step?
Clean and sober: aboutloveanspa on February 12th, 2014 01:51 pm (UTC)
спасибо, поржал.
Leonid Smetanin: pic#114630886leonid_smetanin on February 11th, 2014 05:35 am (UTC)
Greetings!

И сколько лет занял путь?
Dennis Gorelik: 2009dennisgorelik on February 11th, 2014 02:38 pm (UTC)
Depends on when you start counting.
August 1998 I decided to emigrate from Russia.
Some time in 1999 I decided that it should be the US (thanks to Nema Rukavishnikov and others in Russian.Z1).
In 2000 my first would be US employer (Global Consulting Group / Vincent Shelzi) filed H1b for me, which was approved in 2001.
By then there was an economic recession in the US, so my departure had been delayed quite a bit.
April 2003 I came to the US.
In October 2004 I filed for EB-3 Green Card (with another US employer -- Mastech/iGate).
My Green Card was approved in November 2008.
Now it's 2014 already.

So I'd say that the path to the US citizenship took about 15 years (1999 to 2014).


Edited at 2014-02-11 10:18 pm (UTC)
Clean and sober: aboutloveanspa on February 11th, 2014 07:18 am (UTC)
Поздравляю, Денис! А что тебя там спрашивали - готов ли защищать с оружием в руках?
Dennis Gorelik: 2009dennisgorelik on February 11th, 2014 02:40 pm (UTC)
По-моему про оружие ничего не было.
Но про defend вроде бы было.
Интервью было довольно кратким.
Clean and sober: aboutloveanspa on February 12th, 2014 01:53 pm (UTC)
В клятве это звучит как "I will bear arms on behalf of the United States when required by the law;" - в моем случае азиатский дядька-офицер во время интервью принципиально хотел знать, буду ли я готов это делать.
Dennis Gorelikdennisgorelik on February 11th, 2014 05:43 pm (UTC)
I think one of the questions was "Do you like the United States?"
+ few more personal questions.

+ 6 civics questions such as "What is the Amendment?" and "What is the supreme law of the land".
Clean and sober: aboutloveanspa on February 12th, 2014 01:54 pm (UTC)
Ну это да. На уровне сельской библиотеки, пришлось заучить. Какие были первые 13 штатов и прочее.
Dennis Gorelikdennisgorelik on February 12th, 2014 02:14 pm (UTC)
Надо сказать, что официальный учебник по подготовке к civics экзамену написан довольно неплохо.
Я нашёл лишь пару натяжек.
Типа того, что Линкольн якобы "preserved the Union" (про то, что он его чуть не развалил сначала скромно умалчивается).
Denis Novaktaganay on February 11th, 2014 11:53 am (UTC)
Поздравляю!
Dennis Gorelik: 2009dennisgorelik on February 11th, 2014 02:40 pm (UTC)
Спасибо. Но гражданства-то всё ещё нет.
Сколько у тебя заняло получение американского гражданства?
Denis Novak: mitektaganay on February 12th, 2014 04:08 am (UTC)
Но гражданства-то всё ещё нет.
Но тебе же дали бумагу с датой присяги? Считай, что уже все - нужно очень сильно постараться, чтобы на этом этапе не дали.
У меня заняло как-то очень долго - около полугода от интервью до присяги.. Но я нарвался на дуру, которая придралась на интервью - потребовала выписки их судов по поводу штрафов за превышение скорости (я до сих пор не знаю,надо ли было их указывать). После того, как я их послал - ни ответа, ни привета. Я даже конгрессмену писал - все напрасно. В конце концов послал в USCIS официальный запрос - что за фигня происходит. Они не ответили на запрос в течении 3-х месяцев, хотя были обязаны. Тогда я им послал ещё один запрос - что же вы, гады, не отвечаете? И помогло: позвонили и сказали приезжать на присягу. Но нервов помотали изрядно.
Dennis Gorelikdennisgorelik on February 12th, 2014 08:42 am (UTC)
> Но тебе же дали бумагу с датой присяги?

Пока нет - пришлют по почте.
Дали receipt о том, что успешно прошёл интервью.


В каком году ты получил гражданство?
convertor: pic#87566486con_vertor on February 11th, 2014 03:12 pm (UTC)
поздравляю!
Dennis Gorelikdennisgorelik on February 11th, 2014 05:49 pm (UTC)
Спасибо.
fatoff: pic#108054206fatoff on February 13th, 2014 12:25 am (UTC)
Поздравляю!

Вот задумался, пора ли мне... скоро можно.
Dennis Gorelikdennisgorelik on February 13th, 2014 12:38 am (UTC)
Можно подавать за ~три месяца до отметки в пять лет после получения green card.
dimatorm: pic#102063086dimatorm on February 14th, 2014 12:45 pm (UTC)
кул!