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15 February 2015 @ 12:36 am
Россия не нападала не Украину  
... по мнению российской писательницы-фантастки.

Есть что-то странное в сообществе российских писателей-фантастов.
Лукьяненко, мой челябинский друг, а теперь вот skadi_omsk.

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Отсюда:
http://ivan-gandhi.livejournal.com/3078159.html?thread=47883791#t47883791

dennisgorelik: Какие товары и услуги предоставляет вам ДНР/ЛНР?

skadi_omsk: Уверенность в завтрашнем дне. Пока существует Новороссия, Россия не превратится в Украину.

.....

skadi_omsk: Забавно то, что Россия не нападала не Украину.

dennisgorelik: Каким образом тогда получилось так, что российская армия и полиция контролирует Крым, а украинской армии и милиции в Крыму нет?

> Например, вся продукция оборонного сектора, закупавшаяся на Украине, сегодня производится в России.

dennisgorelik: Что же положительного в этом изменении?
Ведь украинскую продукцию покупали не просто так, а потому что она была либо дешевле, либо качественнее.

То есть заменили либо на более дорогую, либо на менее качественную продукцию внутрироссийского производства.

skadi_omsk: Чиновники понимают, что лучше поделиться частью, чем потерять все.

dennisgorelik: Вы хотите сказать, что российские чиновники стали меньше воровать?

Понятно, что в пересчёте на доллары они стали воровать меньше.
Но неужели чиновники стали воровать меньше в процентном отношении от размера российской экономики?

skadi_omsk: К сожалению, не могу продолжить беседу из-за недовольства хозяина журнала.
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Надеюсь skadi_omsk удастся изложить свою позицию.
 
 
 
журнал закрытjuan_gandhi on February 15th, 2015 06:07 am (UTC)
Я не знаю, какая она там писательница, но мне ее ватная жвачка нафиг не нужна. Как советскую газету читаешь. Ну и дура-дурой, соответственно.
Dennis Gorelikdennisgorelik on February 15th, 2015 06:30 am (UTC)
Писательница-любительница.
И типичный представитель.

А потому, что писательница - может быть ей удастся изложить.

Но я помню, что ты не этнолог.
(no subject) - skadi_omsk on February 15th, 2015 08:25 am (UTC) (Expand)
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Ку - (Anonymous) on February 16th, 2015 03:44 am (UTC) (Expand)
Re: Ку - dennisgorelik on February 16th, 2015 04:27 am (UTC) (Expand)
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wenas_yakimawenas_yakima on February 15th, 2015 06:45 am (UTC)
Стругацкие считались самыми лучшими фантастами. И практически диссидентами. А писали про Всегалактическое КГБ. И язвы капиталистического мира.

Неудивительно что с таким стартом русская фантастика превратилась в вату первой.
Deemon: samuraideemon on February 15th, 2015 02:22 pm (UTC)
похоже, у вас бесконечный запас бисера
Dennis Gorelikdennisgorelik on February 15th, 2015 02:30 pm (UTC)
Запас бисера, конечно, не бесконечный, но повальное политическое сумасшествие россиян было для меня неожиданным, а потому я провожу тщательное исследование: характерные симптомы, способы заражения и возможные методы лечения.
(no subject) - naukarus on February 16th, 2015 01:26 am (UTC) (Expand)
(no subject) - dennisgorelik on February 16th, 2015 01:47 am (UTC) (Expand)
(Deleted comment)
(no subject) - dennisgorelik on February 16th, 2015 04:08 am (UTC) (Expand)
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(no subject) - dennisgorelik on February 16th, 2015 05:53 am (UTC) (Expand)
fatofffatoff on February 15th, 2015 03:47 pm (UTC)
Ну не понравился переворот против (относительно) дружественной власти, совершённый с известно чьей поддержкой в соседней стране. Ни России не понравился, ни жителям востока Украины. Когда они подумали, что тоже могут, как на Майдане определять свою судьбу с оржуием в руках, в них стали стрелять новые власти. И понеслась.

Нет, первопричина не в России, несмотря на её несомненное участие. Каждый день подкидывает подобные заметки, вот ещё одна.

Edited at 2015-02-15 04:04 pm (UTC)
Dennis Gorelikdennisgorelik on February 16th, 2015 12:30 am (UTC)
Так ты считаешь что Россия напала на Украину или нет?
(no subject) - fatoff on February 16th, 2015 01:19 am (UTC) (Expand)
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ennemidupeupleennemidupeuple on February 15th, 2015 08:10 pm (UTC)
Очередная жертва телевизора... Хотя это даже не телевизор: все эти байки про МВФ, Федеральную резервную систему, бумажку-доллар, которую "нам навязали", либералов-црушников, предателя Андропова-Филькенштейна, назначившего на ключевые посты "агентов влияния" - весь этот краткий курс ватных истин распространялся и пропитывал массы с конца 90-х. В 2014 это все просто всплыло на поверхность, а в глубинах-то мрак клубился давно.

Ну а почему фантасты? Большинство фантастов вышло из среды инженеров советских НИИ, т.е. работников ВПК. Ни по какой иной категории реформы 90-х не ударили с такой силой, как по этому слою: они потеряли статус, хорошо оплачиваемую стабильную работу, всякие перспективы. Деклассировались. Неудивительно, что среди них Веймарский синдром особенно силен.
Dennis Gorelikdennisgorelik on February 16th, 2015 12:57 am (UTC)
Разве у инженеров НИИ была хорошооплачиваемая работа?
Они же зарабатывали раза в полтора меньше рабочих на заводах.
(no subject) - ennemidupeuple on February 16th, 2015 01:40 am (UTC) (Expand)
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(no subject) - skadi_omsk on February 16th, 2015 07:08 pm (UTC) (Expand)
(no subject) - dennisgorelik on February 16th, 2015 07:12 pm (UTC) (Expand)
(no subject) - skadi_omsk on February 16th, 2015 07:13 pm (UTC) (Expand)
(no subject) - dennisgorelik on February 16th, 2015 07:18 pm (UTC) (Expand)
(no subject) - skadi_omsk on February 16th, 2015 07:23 pm (UTC) (Expand)
(no subject) - dennisgorelik on February 16th, 2015 07:36 pm (UTC) (Expand)
(no subject) - skadi_omsk on February 16th, 2015 07:41 pm (UTC) (Expand)
(no subject) - dennisgorelik on February 16th, 2015 08:18 pm (UTC) (Expand)
(no subject) - skadi_omsk on February 17th, 2015 03:21 am (UTC) (Expand)
(no subject) - dennisgorelik on February 17th, 2015 06:40 am (UTC) (Expand)
(no subject) - skadi_omsk on February 17th, 2015 09:46 am (UTC) (Expand)
(no subject) - dennisgorelik on February 17th, 2015 05:05 pm (UTC) (Expand)
(no subject) - skadi_omsk on February 17th, 2015 05:33 pm (UTC) (Expand)
(no subject) - dennisgorelik on February 17th, 2015 05:38 pm (UTC) (Expand)
(no subject) - skadi_omsk on February 17th, 2015 05:51 pm (UTC) (Expand)
(no subject) - dennisgorelik on February 17th, 2015 06:46 pm (UTC) (Expand)
(Deleted comment)
(no subject) - skadi_omsk on February 16th, 2015 06:53 pm (UTC) (Expand)
(Deleted comment)
(no subject) - skadi_omsk on February 17th, 2015 03:30 am (UTC) (Expand)
(no subject) - wenas_yakima on February 17th, 2015 04:25 am (UTC) (Expand)
(no subject) - skadi_omsk on February 17th, 2015 05:35 pm (UTC) (Expand)
(no subject) - russian_666 on February 16th, 2015 03:46 am (UTC) (Expand)
ennemidupeupleennemidupeuple on February 16th, 2015 04:22 am (UTC)
да, это уже клиническая картина.
(no subject) - russian_666 on February 16th, 2015 04:22 am (UTC) (Expand)
(no subject) - ennemidupeuple on February 16th, 2015 04:29 am (UTC) (Expand)
(no subject) - russian_666 on February 16th, 2015 04:29 am (UTC) (Expand)
(no subject) - dennisgorelik on February 16th, 2015 04:31 am (UTC) (Expand)
(no subject) - russian_666 on February 16th, 2015 04:32 am (UTC) (Expand)
(no subject) - ennemidupeuple on February 16th, 2015 04:32 am (UTC) (Expand)
(no subject) - russian_666 on February 16th, 2015 04:33 am (UTC) (Expand)
(no subject) - dennisgorelik on February 16th, 2015 04:34 am (UTC) (Expand)
(no subject) - russian_666 on February 16th, 2015 04:36 am (UTC) (Expand)
(no subject) - dennisgorelik on February 16th, 2015 04:39 am (UTC) (Expand)
(no subject) - russian_666 on February 16th, 2015 04:40 am (UTC) (Expand)
(no subject) - dennisgorelik on February 16th, 2015 04:42 am (UTC) (Expand)
(no subject) - russian_666 on February 16th, 2015 04:44 am (UTC) (Expand)
(no subject) - dennisgorelik on February 16th, 2015 04:46 am (UTC) (Expand)
(no subject) - ennemidupeuple on February 16th, 2015 04:34 am (UTC) (Expand)
(no subject) - dennisgorelik on February 16th, 2015 04:28 am (UTC) (Expand)
(no subject) - russian_666 on February 16th, 2015 04:29 am (UTC) (Expand)
(no subject) - dennisgorelik on February 16th, 2015 04:32 am (UTC) (Expand)
(no subject) - russian_666 on February 16th, 2015 04:34 am (UTC) (Expand)
(no subject) - dennisgorelik on February 16th, 2015 04:36 am (UTC) (Expand)
(no subject) - dennisgorelik on February 16th, 2015 04:42 am (UTC) (Expand)
(no subject) - russian_666 on February 16th, 2015 07:58 pm (UTC) (Expand)
(no subject) - dennisgorelik on February 16th, 2015 08:10 pm (UTC) (Expand)
(no subject) - russian_666 on February 16th, 2015 08:16 pm (UTC) (Expand)
(no subject) - dennisgorelik on February 16th, 2015 08:22 pm (UTC) (Expand)
(no subject) - russian_666 on February 16th, 2015 08:36 pm (UTC) (Expand)
(no subject) - dennisgorelik on February 16th, 2015 09:24 pm (UTC) (Expand)
(no subject) - russian_666 on February 16th, 2015 10:03 pm (UTC) (Expand)
(no subject) - dennisgorelik on February 16th, 2015 10:41 pm (UTC) (Expand)
(no subject) - russian_666 on February 17th, 2015 03:21 am (UTC) (Expand)
(no subject) - dennisgorelik on February 17th, 2015 03:47 am (UTC) (Expand)
(no subject) - russian_666 on February 17th, 2015 03:22 pm (UTC) (Expand)
(no subject) - dennisgorelik on February 17th, 2015 05:04 pm (UTC) (Expand)
(no subject) - russian_666 on February 18th, 2015 02:24 am (UTC) (Expand)
(no subject) - dennisgorelik on February 18th, 2015 03:35 am (UTC) (Expand)
(no subject) - russian_666 on February 18th, 2015 03:36 am (UTC) (Expand)
(no subject) - dennisgorelik on February 18th, 2015 03:48 am (UTC) (Expand)
(no subject) - russian_666 on February 18th, 2015 04:04 am (UTC) (Expand)
(no subject) - russian_666 on February 16th, 2015 08:38 pm (UTC) (Expand)
(no subject) - dennisgorelik on February 16th, 2015 09:24 pm (UTC) (Expand)
(no subject) - ygam on February 16th, 2015 07:39 pm (UTC) (Expand)
(no subject) - russian_666 on February 16th, 2015 07:44 pm (UTC) (Expand)
(no subject) - dennisgorelik on February 16th, 2015 07:55 pm (UTC) (Expand)
(no subject) - ygam on February 16th, 2015 08:06 pm (UTC) (Expand)
(no subject) - russian_666 on February 16th, 2015 08:16 pm (UTC) (Expand)
(no subject) - ygam on February 16th, 2015 08:28 pm (UTC) (Expand)
(no subject) - dennisgorelik on February 16th, 2015 07:52 pm (UTC) (Expand)
(no subject) - hobober on February 27th, 2015 07:35 am (UTC) (Expand)
(no subject) - dennisgorelik on February 27th, 2015 08:02 am (UTC) (Expand)
(no subject) - hobober on February 28th, 2015 06:06 pm (UTC) (Expand)
(no subject) - dennisgorelik on February 28th, 2015 07:50 pm (UTC) (Expand)
fatofffatoff on February 27th, 2015 04:05 pm (UTC)
Актуально для понимания, как это начиналось: http://www.valuewalk.com/2015/02/ukraine-ex-army-russia-crimea/
Dennis Gorelikdennisgorelik on February 27th, 2015 08:15 pm (UTC)
Получается, что это была плохо спланированная аннексия.
(no subject) - fatoff on February 27th, 2015 08:20 pm (UTC) (Expand)
(no subject) - hobober on February 28th, 2015 06:09 pm (UTC) (Expand)
kouzdrakouzdra on February 28th, 2015 12:42 pm (UTC)
> Например, вся продукция оборонного сектора, закупавшаяся на Украине, сегодня производится в России.

dennisgorelik: Что же положительного в этом изменении?
Ведь украинскую продукцию покупали не просто так, а потому что она была либо дешевле, либо качественнее.

То есть заменили либо на более дорогую, либо на менее качественную продукцию внутрироссийского производства.


Про ваши символы веры не буду - но вы правда не понимаете элементарной арифметики:

Вот допустим вместо ракеты "Зенит" за $40 лимонов РФ заукпила за $50 ракету "Ангара" (цифры и наименования достаточно условные) - при этом эти $50 однако пошли на оплату рабочих инженеров етц - с них были уплачены налоги - ну и дальше эти деньги пошли по цепочке

То есть бюджет вернул примерно $20 - ну и поддержал заодно производство на которое есть спрос не только тут - но даже фиг с ним с производством чисто по деньгам бюджет в плюсе.

Что вам кажется странным?

Вот что мне кажется странным - что западные политики на чистом глазу пытаюся впаривать подобную пургу про "рынок" даже на уровне где все прикидывается на пальцах.
Dennis Gorelikdennisgorelik on February 28th, 2015 08:11 pm (UTC)
> дальше эти деньги пошли по цепочке

Деньги идут по цепочке вне зависимости от того, где они тратятся.
Если $40M потрачены за границей, то на эти $40М заграница закупает отечественные товары и услуги, при производстве которых точно также берутся налоги.
(no subject) - kouzdra on March 1st, 2015 05:59 am (UTC) (Expand)
(no subject) - dennisgorelik on March 1st, 2015 06:15 am (UTC) (Expand)
(no subject) - kouzdra on March 1st, 2015 06:21 am (UTC) (Expand)
(no subject) - dennisgorelik on March 1st, 2015 06:28 am (UTC) (Expand)
(no subject) - kouzdra on March 1st, 2015 06:36 am (UTC) (Expand)
(no subject) - dennisgorelik on March 1st, 2015 06:46 am (UTC) (Expand)
(no subject) - kouzdra on March 1st, 2015 06:55 am (UTC) (Expand)
(no subject) - dennisgorelik on March 1st, 2015 07:27 am (UTC) (Expand)
(no subject) - oboguev on March 2nd, 2015 02:50 am (UTC) (Expand)
(no subject) - dennisgorelik on March 2nd, 2015 04:02 am (UTC) (Expand)
(no subject) - oboguev on March 2nd, 2015 07:52 am (UTC) (Expand)
(no subject) - dennisgorelik on March 2nd, 2015 09:20 am (UTC) (Expand)
(no subject) - oboguev on March 2nd, 2015 06:59 pm (UTC) (Expand)
(no subject) - dennisgorelik on March 2nd, 2015 08:19 pm (UTC) (Expand)
(no subject) - oboguev on March 2nd, 2015 08:33 pm (UTC) (Expand)
(no subject) - dennisgorelik on March 2nd, 2015 09:23 pm (UTC) (Expand)
(no subject) - oboguev on March 2nd, 2015 10:13 pm (UTC) (Expand)
(no subject) - dennisgorelik on March 2nd, 2015 10:17 pm (UTC) (Expand)
(no subject) - oboguev on March 2nd, 2015 10:22 pm (UTC) (Expand)
(no subject) - dennisgorelik on March 2nd, 2015 10:35 pm (UTC) (Expand)
(no subject) - oboguev on March 3rd, 2015 04:21 am (UTC) (Expand)
(no subject) - dennisgorelik on March 3rd, 2015 07:24 am (UTC) (Expand)
(no subject) - kouzdra on March 1st, 2015 06:07 am (UTC) (Expand)
(no subject) - dennisgorelik on March 1st, 2015 06:23 am (UTC) (Expand)
(no subject) - kouzdra on March 1st, 2015 06:29 am (UTC) (Expand)
(no subject) - dennisgorelik on March 1st, 2015 06:41 am (UTC) (Expand)
(no subject) - kouzdra on March 1st, 2015 06:50 am (UTC) (Expand)